Sporting Shooters Association Vice President Chaz Forsyth described some fee hikes as outrageous.
“They will only serve to drive many away from firearm ownership or alternatively see massive non-compliance”, he said.
An example was that currently dealers pay $50 to transfer their dealers licence to a gun show or auction venue. Now police are proposing that the $50 fee should increase to $1,120.
“This in its self will deter many smaller dealerships from talking part in gun shows”.
Police are now proposing that collectors pay a fee of $1,100 for permission to remove a restricted firearm from their home to display at a public show or club event which will mean the end of public displays or military reenactments by private collectors with their heritage arms, said Chaz Forsyth.
All these additional cost have been forced on the firearm community by the government and police with their new laws and regulations in the name of making the public safer.
“It is only fair and reasonable that any additional costs of regulating firearms in New Zealand is born by the public purse,” he said.
Further it should be noted that with only the new police Firearm Safety Authority legally allowed to charge these fees, there is no incentive for improving efficiency or competitive pricing.
“We are stuck with a ponderous monopoly,” said Chaz Forsyth.
Support for the Sporting Shooters’ Association came from the Sporting Hunters’ Outdoor Trust. Trust spokesman Laurie Collins said the motive behind the “outrageous hike” in fees seemed to be to disarm the law abiding firearm owning public.
Laurie Collins said the question is was police bureaucracy a competent agency to administer firearm laws. There has been more crime by gangs since government rushed, panicked laws following the 2019 mosque tragedy, laws that almost certainly have increased the gangs’ arsenals.
Chaz Forsyth – “ police fee hikes are outrageous”
Once people respected the police but their recent actions and spokesmen like Police Assn., president Chris Cahill have done much to undermine public confidence.
What agenda now drives their moves?
Cahill and company need a sharp reminder they are public servants and NZ is a democracy.
So the police want to cover costs by charging exorbitant fees. How very, very convenient except for one thing. The firearm owning public as distinct from criminals, gangs and the underworld, pay taxes. We have already paid.
I smell the stench of a political agenda to disarm the law respecting public who own firearms for peaceful and lawful purposes such as hunting, rifle clubs, etc.
The hidden long term agenda is to remove all firearms from public ownership & any legitamate use.
All the new work requiring 400 police staff to administer the Arms Act and Regulations is due to the rushed legislation passed by the Labour Party, supposedly to make New Zealand safer. If all these new regulations are for the purposes of public safety, then it should be paid for by the public, (Government) NOT the firearm owning community who have to suffer the indignity of all this police interference in their sport, hobby or businesses.
Any fees should be kept to a minimum to encourage compliance in the Arms Act.
The government think that Joe public should not pay for administration of the new firearms act. After all, it was the government that came up with it on Joe P’s behalf, to keep Joe P safe, remember?
So if the public don’t perceive any value from the act and don’t want to pay for it and us LFO’s don’t want to pay then why are we doing this?
Here’s another example of the extreme; we must get a permit for every part, screw or spring etc. I could go to a hardware shop and get something that works, but I want the correct fitting screw or spring. So a $10 spring of screw is going to cost me a $500 permit to import now?
Where is the independent firearms authority to oversee the licencing of legitimate sporting shooters and collectors that Ardern promised us? Oh, I see, it was just another of her many, many lies to the New Zealand public.
The police have shown over and over that they are not the right organisation to administer firearms licencing and the very idea that they should be responsible for a useless and vastly expensive attempt to register all lawfully owned guns is simply beyond belief. The Canadians tried universal registration against the advice of the New Zealand police who were specifically consulted because our firearms legislation used to be the best, most effective and cost effective gun laws in the world until Ardern came along and mucked it all up, and Canada ended up wasting 2 billion dollars on the failed project before scrapping it.
I am up to page 49 of the 73 page “proposed fees” discussion document put out by NZ Police. As A firearms owner, shooter, hunter, collector I am outraged by these ridiculous price increase. As an example, it used to cost $25 for a pistol competition shooter to get a visitor licence, they are proposing $470 & have the cheek to suggest it won’t put people off coming to NZ to compete in shooting events. Currently it costs $204 to get an endorsement on your licence, they are suggesting an increase to $1510 every 5 years! And that’s just scratching the surface! The dealers are getting hit even harder, with multiple fees every year for $1000’s of dollars. And guess where the follow on price hike will hit…..us! In the past if a part for one of my firearms broke, I could apply for a permit to import a new part from overseas for free, now they suggest a fee of $590! Insane. If this goes through I would imagine a massive kick back from what would normally be compliant, fit & proper firearms owners, huge non compliance, more guns in the hands of gangs & on the “grey” market. Why are we expected to pay for new laws/ agencies that only exist because of NZ Police failings? Get tough on crime, and illegally owned firearms, don’t penalise harmless hunters, competition shooters, collecters & dealers. Obvious attempt by Labour government & Police to “eradicate” NZ public gun ownership.
So the legal firearms owner has to pay to make NZ a ‘safer place’ while those who hold firearms illegally seem to use them on police and rivals, with no consequence.
If the Police want the support of LEGAL firearms owners, they’ve a funny way of asking for it.
Ridiculous
It seems Senior NZ Police and Labour politicians are completely out of touch with the reality of pay scales and the tightness of family budgeting for a large portion of NZ taxpayers. Ordinary Kiwis won’t be able to afford these fees and will have a choice of non compliance or giving up their sport. Labour need to realise many of their own supporters supplement their family food supply through hunting and this may well cause people to go hungry. Perhaps a pay cut for the Politicians and Police would help. And a full inquiry into why it is suddenly costing so much to administer the Arms Act when we know previously money from the Firearms Licensing budget was being diverted to other Police activities. Final note – Police are back to online vetting – the very thing that contributed to CHCH! This is not about safety!
This is an unfortunate consequence of precipitate and poorly thought out legislation. While I’m sure the intention wasn’t to penalise legitimate firearms users (at least I hope not) the unintended consequences from this legislation may be far-reaching. Especially the cost passed on to clubs and dealers conducting safe and legitimate business.
To add onerous costs to the people who are not the problem seems crazy and I hope our politicians see sense on this subject as election time approaches. I believe NZ First dropping their support for shooters and ACT’s stepping up changed the political landscape. While firearms users come from all walks of life and support a range of parties, and while we don’t vote as a block, I do believe that the contempt shown to shooters by major parties during the rewriting of the arms laws has shifted the votes of a considerable number of people. ACT can attribute a lot of their success at the last election to the good works of Nicole McKee.
Nicole is an absolute stand out for us shooters and there needs to more shooters appreciate what she has done and continues to do for us. Winnie and Ron Mark both told us they would look after shooters, yeah right!!! National has not been any better in speaking on our behalf. I feel for my grandson, who wants my firearms when I croak, but he won’t be able to afford it.
If cost recovery is so important to this government and the Police, I’d like them to tell us when they intend to charge convicted criminals including gang members for the huge amount of Police and health resources paid for by the public via their taxes as a result of their illegal activity and the huge negative impact it has on society.
This comes as no surprise. The writing has been on the wall since this government first decided to scapegoat lawful and legitimate Firearms Licence Holders .. with its unfair, unreasonable, and unjustified firearms law reforms .. for political expediency, following the 2019 Chch Mosque Shootings.
There has been a massively sharp increase in the number of New Zealanders crying foul .. on a broad range of topics .. under this government. There have been more protests .. attended by more people .. representing more groups .. across more subjects .. than ever before, in living memory.
All New Zealanders owe these brave souls a huge debt of gratitude.
For they are a bellweather .. sounding a warning bell to all New Zealanders .. of the dire direction in which our country is headed.
We have just received a clear signal of this government’s arrogance in trampling roughshod over our democracy and democratic due processes, our rights, and our freedoms .. the passing of the Three Waters legislation .. against the clear, demonstrated wishes of all other political parties .. local government .. and the majority of the general population.
The biggest symptoms impacting on the general public as a result of a socialist / communist regime .. are authoritarianism and state control. It begins with too much unnecessary state interference in people’s lives.
Surely, it should have slowly dawned on most New Zealanders by now .. that this is the way this government is taking us.
We are all like the frogs who have been put in a cauldron of cold water, and placed over a fire. The water has slowly been heating .. and many New Zealanders have not noticed.
The million dollar question is .. will we wake up, and jump to safety in time?
Or, will many leave it until too late?
The balance of New Zealanders ought to sit up and take notice .. of the loudly clanging warning bells .. and the rapidly changing temperature of the water we are all sitting in.
We must learn to stick together. To stand up and unite against a common foe.
Martin Niemöller was a prominent Protestant pastor who emerged as an outspoken public foe of Adolf Hitler and spent the last seven years of Nazi rule in concentration camps.
Niemöller is perhaps best remembered for the quotation:
“First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out … Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out …
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out …
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me … and there was no one left to speak for me.“
Government always passes unpopular legislation in December. They think people will not notice because summer holidays are close. Sorry Government, many of us can spot the trickery and dishonesty. The outrageous changes to firearms legislation comes on top of the theft of our water assets (three waters legislation), changes to the Resource Management Act, changes to Incorporated Societies etc. Plenty of us know about Agenda 2021, Agenda 2030, One World Government, The World Economic Forum, Globalism, the Great Reset, etc. The globalist super rich have agendas and one of them is to disarm Joe Public. History is littered with tyrants, fascists and dictators who have tried this before. They are cunning and manipulative, thirsty for power.
They preach democracy and collectivism where individual rights are sacrificed for the greater good, for public safety, for our collective health, or any other excuse they can think of to trample on basic human freedoms. Voting for a different political party is not going to stop this. I predict a great reset coming but I doubt it will be the one the Globalists want. It’s the one we get when the disenchanted public say no and refuse to cooperate with the ridiculous rules officialdom.
While it was previously said that NZ is a democracy, I am afraid that I now have serious doubts. With costs and compliance now leveled at clubs in the name of public safety when to my knowledge there have been few if any serious accidents,and now a 72 page consultant document with increased costs costs across the board for all firearm transactions, one wonders is the labour party is running short of cash and we as LFO are an easy target to obtain the extra dollars after all we were branded both by ministers and politicians as gun nuts amoungst other things and since it is a privilege not a right to own a weapon we will be forced to pay for that right. I suggest that their costing model could lead to non compliance.
$1000 to$1700 for a import permit you go to the cop shop write on a pad form they give you a copy you go to customs collect your item you go back to cop shop show your item they sign the form DONE so for three minutes work you have to pay this that means the police charge out rate is $34000 an hour wtf!!!!!
I have already made my submission on this scandalous new regime.
To be a bit cynical, could it be that police are precipitating a lot of non0compiance to justify a lot more draconian actions to completely disarm all civilians, except the gangs and criminals of course, who always have and always will do as they please?
This new imposition on the innocent can have no other outcome but yet another large increase in the illegal firearms pool, which will delight the criminal element in society.
After all, just before the last confiscation the criminal fraternity were offering two to three times retail for a working AR15, AK variant, SKS, M14, L1A1, Dragunov etc. and I am sure that some succumbed to the temptation out of sheer anger and frustration at the injustice of it all.
These new fees will certainly mean that I will no longer be able to afford my “D” licence, and with the advent of full registration (another futile bureaucratic exercise) even working on an “A” cat firearm will be next door to impossible as the charge to cover all the new charges will make the work uneconomic.
This whole exercise is an unconscionable imposition on the innocent to cover up the tragic consequences of incompetent administering the old gun laws (Aramoana, Napier and Chch) and heaven sent chance for the Left Wing, who hate the idea of an armed population, to disarm us.
The fee system has obviously worked well for the last 20 years as there has been no major attempts to overhaul it. If the Police were sincere on their wish to recover some of the cost then a fair percentage increase on existing rates would be reasonable. However it is obvious there is a deeper political agenda at play here.
This ‘cost recovery’ exercise is just an attempt by the government to stop private firearm ownership. If the police continue along the these lines they will further alienate themselves from a large part of the law abiding community. They need to stop this nonsense, have a rethink and come up with a realistic plan
This is ridiculous Police wanting to do cost recovery they are paid by the taxpayer to do their job. In most circumstances they themselves are not doing the interviews they have employed members of the public to do this. If and I stress IF they had done their job in the first place the tragedy in Christchurch would never have happened. The referee was known to the Christchurch shooter for only three weeks apparently and Police allowed that to be enough to issue a firearms licence. Were the Police held accountable for not doing their job short answer no. Changing what we have will only force noncompliance amongst legal Licence holders. Cost recovery will not change what the criminals do with firearms. Retired New South Wales Police weapons instructor.
Further to my comments regarding Police and cost recovery, are they not setting a dangerous precedent, what is to stop them for charging cost recovery for attending an accident, burglary, issuing a traffic ticket etc. Should we the public charge the Police cost recovery on attending the police academy, their uniform, Police cars, petrol, oil, tyres, electricity etc Regards.
Here’s a personal story:
I am totally disgusted with the machinations of the current Labour Government and the NZ Police hierarchy, with regard to ownership of firearms by already vetted ‘fit and proper persons’.
I am an 82 year old military veteran; a Life Member of the NZ Pistol Association; and previously the 30-year editor of that association’s magazine.
In year 2000, due to NZ Police actions in placing additional restrictions on our pistol sport, I sold the last of my target pistols – Score 1 to the NZ Police.
This year I also sold my lever-action Marlin rifle and double barrel shotgun – Score 2 to the NZ Police.
I am now left with my grand-daughter’s .22 Marlin rifle in my gun safe, along with an antique single shot .22 rifle that was my grandfather’s (I still have the original paper registration for it as well, duly annotated by transfer to my name, at a then cost to the Police of 2/6d!
My firearm licence expires in 2014 and this whole draconian Government and Police plan will ensure that I will have great pleasure in throwing those two firearms into a deep portion of the Waikato River, rather than pay such ridiculous costs – Score 10 to Me!
Authoritarian behaviour by our Government and its enforcer, the NZ Police. The usual threats of fines/imprisonment if firearm owners don’t toe the line are akin to Vladimir Putins playbook. Law abiding New Zealanders are an easy target for the enforcers rather than the out-of-control criminal violence and gang warfare across the country.
Ultimately, it was Police incompetence that enabled the Mosque shooter to obtain a Firearms Licence and ever since, as Police quote ad nauseam, to ensure ‘public safety’ the honest firearm users have been targeted with screeds of ridiculous new regulations and proposed fee increases in all manner of firearm activities to help fund the Firearms Safety Authority. It’s a smoke screen for the uneducated firearm public to hide Police incompetence.
Despite submissions on proposes fee changes, we know Police will ignore them and do what they want. So much for Democracy. Police have no respect from me.
What a lot of Wallies they are. I think they think we came down in the last shower well I have news for them. All this is going to do is drive rifles underground and they are making law-abiding people into gang members as we the legal owner will be classed as such. Their idea is to get the firearms off us, well that is not going to happen. Having a register is not worth even thinking about as they don’t work and they want us to pay for this. Go play with someone else toys or go back to your knitting.
Spending $500 million (and the rest) on a gun registry to register some of the guns owned by legitimate, licenced shooters will surely solve the problem….NOT. Actually I suspect that the pool of unregistered guns will increase massively because gun owners are so pissed off with Ardern and the politicized police force that non compliance will be massive. We know the only reason for a gun registry is to draw up a shopping list for criminals to steal and for the police to confiscate.
We desperately need ACT in government, their firearms policy is sound and mostly workable. Sign up for Nicole McKee’s regular updates to keep informed as we are about to be screwed again while the gangs and other criminals laugh at the way the police constantly go after the wrong target.
https://fairfirearmslaws.act.org.nz/
I am a independent firearms dealer and shop owner, I am speechless regarding these proposals and increased fees.
Unaffordability is already occurring in this sport with the worldwide recession and increased cost globe we are living on, this will be a kick in the guts to our hard working men and women that escape the stress of the week with a rifle to the bush .
Non compliance will be massive, Just this morning all coming thru are talking about completely ignoring all new rules and fees
The to be organised protests and fight back needs to be massive.
It has been a long time coming at least for me. When you know the outcome it is so easy to see the journey. I have been following the journey for over 10 years now. ( Late I know, but better late than never)
The twisted barrel on a Colt Python outside the offices of the U.N. in New York is as symbolic as it gets.
This is just another step toward the totalitarian state. There are many people who are ignorant of what is happening. Covid showed us just how ignorant people can be. Unless we wake up and are willing to put our differences aside for the common good and unite as one, or else we are doomed as a world population, never mind NZ, to be subjected to total tyranny. We here in NZ as well as Canada and Australia are the test mice to see how much we are willing to take. So far we are not doing well, and mice is appropriate. I look on at the haka at times and I must say I am embarrassed for all kiwis.